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kimbowbill
20-08-2012, 16:15
I emailed SBC for some clarity on parking, this is my email

Hi

I understand there is no parking of Motorhomes in Scarborough and surrounding areas

I am staying in a cottage at Robin Hoods bay with my family, 7th - 8th Sept 2012 my only mode of transport is my Motorhome, where my dogs will be staying. My intention was to park the van in the top car park and stay with my family in the cottage, but now i see this is banned, can you advise me where i can park, i will not be sleeping in my van,

Kind regards


this is their response

Dear Ms

A vehicle may park overnight providing a ticket is purchased to cover any time between 9am and 6pm. However the Civil Enforcement Officer will issue a ticket should he believe that the vehicle is being used for camping or cooking.

Regards

Parking Services

Is it me or is that just the most stupidest response ever? what does it mean? so basically how i read it is they can issue a ticket and you have to prove your not in the van or do they have to prove you are in the van ?

Firefox
20-08-2012, 16:23
What a completely stupid response.

In my case they could not tell anyone was in the vehicle.

maingate
20-08-2012, 16:29
Scarborough Council have purchased a Snore Detector and have trained a Council employee in its use.

I wouldn't get away with it. I give out about 80 Decibels when I am asleep. :o

Funky Farmer
20-08-2012, 16:39
Scarborough Council have purchased a Snore Detector and have trained a Council employee in its use.

I wouldn't get away with it. I give out about 80 Decibels when I am asleep. :o

Is that all? Lightweight.:D
And back to the topic. I they were answering Jen's query. She asked about parking whilst staying in a cottage
, not camping per sai. Seems they can't stop you parking if you have paid for a ticket before six. As for overnighting, it seems they don't like it. Just my interpretation you understand.

kimbowbill
20-08-2012, 16:46
if they are saying that then surely they have to prove you are in the van? otherwise they would be issuing tickets LR &C ? pfft, bloody council, i'm still no wiser

John H
20-08-2012, 16:53
If they are serious then it would seem to me that the rule is unenforceable because all you would have to say is that no-one (except your dogs - to take care of the snoring argument!) was in the van. They would have to admit that they couldn't prove otherwise and back down. But it seems to me that they are making it up as they go along!

bill scouse
20-08-2012, 16:59
Surely they can only charge the occupant, which in your case will be the dog as you have clearly stated.

Admin
20-08-2012, 16:59
It is very interesting.

So motorhomes being parked there is not a problem; this is nothing at all to do with parking.
The issue is sleeping or eating in a way that does not produce revenue for the town.

I think it is time we asked why we can not sleep or eat on our vehicles. I am a citizen, I pay my taxes, my vehicle is legal.

Hmmmm

Deleted user 21925
20-08-2012, 17:06
I know Jen that in this case you have to go to Scarborough, but I will avoid the place like the plague!

Mind you, that goes for most seaside towns, give me countryside or a remote beach anyday!

iceman1956
20-08-2012, 17:15
Maybe if we had a concerted campaign to avoid Scarborough for a full 12 months and let them see how much the revenue is down for both the council with parking charges and local businesses with sales, they may understand what benefits we do bring with our motorhomes.

It is a pity we a good way through the main season, or it would hit home sooner. But maybe not!!!!!!

John H
20-08-2012, 17:16
It is very interesting.

So motorhomes being parked there is not a problem; this is nothing at all to do with parking.
The issue is sleeping or eating in a way that does not produce revenue for the town.
I think it is time we asked why we can not sleep or eat on our vehicles. I am a citizen, I pay my taxes, my vehicle is legal.

Hmmmm

I think we should immediately report all those picnickers on the beach and people who are swimming in the sea rather than paying to use the local swimming pool. The world is clearly full of scrounging freeloaders who cannot be allowed to live! :mad1::danger::rulez::lol-053:

Deleted user 21925
20-08-2012, 17:17
I doubt this would make a huge amount of difference, if it did they would blame it on the reccession.

kimbowbill
20-08-2012, 17:17
I know Jen that in this case you have to go to Scarborough, but I will avoid the place like the plague!

Mind you, that goes for most seaside towns, give me countryside or a remote beach anyday!

I agree Rob, but its my annual girly family holiday which we have done for the past 7 years, i have told them tho, this is the last time, they are going to have to choose somewhere that welcomes ALL tourists, i'm really not looking forward to going in my van at all, if you don't hear from me after my weekend, take it the Scarbadions have killed me :scared:

Deleted user 21925
20-08-2012, 17:20
I think Henry might have something to say about that!

Old_Arthur
20-08-2012, 18:02
As a more regular user of scarborough than most on here believe me motorhomers have caused most of this trouble themselves, this last 3/4 yrs as seen a big change in the type of people site dodging instead of creep in crap and creep out again it's more a case of look at what I've got. This weekend i followed the sun down to kent to a spot mentioned on here last week great weekend in a good place,on sunday morning 4vans were parked up along the back hedge of this grass car park over lookin the bay lovely, then a camper van pulled in parked up length ways along the cliff top and set up camp awning out, wind breakers all round his plot guess who most people will remember

iceman1956
20-08-2012, 18:13
I have never put out the awning whilst wildcamping, not there long enough, MMM did a 2 page spread in their August issue on Wise Wildcamping, made quite interesting reading.

But it is very true that there is a small minority who think they have the right to just set up camp anywhere they feel, and unfortunately we are all tard with the same brush. Consideration for other users of the facilities, and being discreet should be the order of the day.

Old_Arthur
20-08-2012, 18:35
I have never put out the awning whilst wildcamping, not there long enough, MMM did a 2 page spread in their August issue on Wise Wildcamping, made quite interesting reading.

But it is very true that there is a small minority who think they have the right to just set up camp anywhere they feel, and unfortunately we are all tard with the same brush. Consideration for other users of the facilities, and being discreet should be the order of the day.

But it's not a small minority there are lots of them that have the same attitude (and i will bet most are members of the big 2 clubs) i site dodge most weekends all year round and cringe at some of the antics i see,the last day or so a guy has been posting a bit antagonist but some of his statements ring true, because it's legal to do so dosen't make it right.

kimbowbill
20-08-2012, 18:38
I'm enjoying your chat guys but back to my OP, can you make any sense of that?

Old_Arthur
20-08-2012, 18:58
No sorry jenny i can't but then again i never ask in case i get an answer i don't want :baby: if it was me i'd park there dure in the day then drive back up to the 2 good parking places near the main road like i always do at night :)
But then again i'm wild at heart

n brown
20-08-2012, 19:12
you're in your cottage and the dogs are in the van.you go to check on the dogs at 11.30,the CEO comes round at that very moment,sees a light in the van.you're nicked !or are you ? unless they can prove that you parked there with the intent to break the law by 'camping',a word that as far as i know means making a camp,then where are they?what if the dogs are feeling lonely,you decide to sit with them a while and nod off[people over the age of 49 do this a lot apparently] bang on the door,you're nicked again !what is 'cooking'? is opening a tin of dog food the same as opening a tin of beans and therefore food preparation? gawd knows.is it worth public money and a good chance of egg on their face to prosecute?

jamesmarshall
20-08-2012, 19:28
I'm enjoying your chat guys but back to my OP, can you make any sense of that?

The way I see it. and I know I'm stating the obvious here, is that many locals don't like motor homes in their town and have gained the support of their Local Council. The Council cannot stop a legally taxed and insured motorhome from accessing parking provided for other motor vehicles (Height barriers acknowledged) but they can stop it being used for overnight habitation. I assume that that the logic is that a motorhome owner will not want to park overnight and not sleep in it, so will be discouraged and move on.
When it comes to appealing against a parking fine, should you be given one by a parking warden in the belief that the motorhome was being used for sleeping in, for example if on knocking he/she hears your dogs barking, you may find yourself up against it. You could perhaps prove you weren't in the vehicle but how do you prove someone else wasn't?
The whole matter becomes a little Kafkaesque.

baldybloke
20-08-2012, 19:30
So would it be 'legal' to park in same carpark, open the boot of my car, and prepare sandwiches or brew a cup of tea, with camping gear that I was carrying in the boot?,then sit in the front and consume the above?. this is something I have done,and seen done on many occasions, when my kids were young it was the only way we could afford to take them out, we could then afford to treat the kids to some of the attractions that cost money,then as now there is a finite availability of funds for most people.

jamesmarshall
20-08-2012, 19:42
So would it be 'legal' to park in same carpark, open the boot of my car, and prepare sandwiches or brew a cup of tea, with camping gear that I was carrying in the boot?,then sit in the front and consume the above?. this is something I have done,and seen done on many occasions, when my kids were young it was the only way we could afford to take them out, we could then afford to treat the kids to some of the attractions that cost money,then as now there is a finite availability of funds for most people.

Herein lies the inequality. At the heart of the matter is the fact that the mere sight of a parked motorhome to some locals immediately has their hackles raised, I suspect that they would have them banned throughout the day if possible but the local authority recognises the fact that sleeping eating and drinking in a motorhome through the day can just as easily be done in a car. To attempt to ban that as well would be to much of a legal headache.

donkey too
20-08-2012, 19:57
The way I see it. and I know I'm stating the obvious here, is that many locals don't like motor homes in their town and have gained the support of their Local Council. The Council cannot stop a legally taxed and insured motorhome from accessing parking provided for other motor vehicles (Height barriers acknowledged) but they can stop it being used for overnight habitation. I assume that that the logic is that a motorhome owner will not want to park overnight and not sleep in it, so will be discouraged and move on.
When it comes to appealing against a parking fine, should you be given one by a parking warden in the belief that the motorhome was being used for sleeping in, for example if on knocking he/she hears your dogs barking, you may find yourself up against it. You could perhaps prove you weren't in the vehicle but how do you prove someone else wasn't?
The whole matter becomes a little Kafkaesque.

No one has to prove they were or were not in the vehicle. The onus is on the council to prove not only someone was sleeping in the vehicle, but who that person was. Just the same as a policeman has to prove who was driving a specific vehicle at a specific time. You would be under no obligation to state who was in that vehicle.
Also does the same rule apply to people eating and sleeping in cars, vans, lorries etc? If not then the are discriminating against you. How many people do you see eating in their cars on a sea front, or having a sleep after dinner etc?

jamesmarshall
20-08-2012, 20:12
No one has to prove they were or were not in the vehicle. The onus is on the council to prove not only someone was sleeping in the vehicle, but who that person was. Just the same as a policeman has to prove who was driving a specific vehicle at a specific time. You would be under no obligation to state who was in that vehicle.
Also does the same rule apply to people eating and sleeping in cars, vans, lorries etc? If not then the are discriminating against you. How many people do you see eating in their cars on a sea front, or having a sleep after dinner etc?

I take your point Donkey Too. My thinking was that some traffic wardens are quick to stick tickets on windscreens which then leaves the car owner/driver to contest it.

oldish hippy
20-08-2012, 21:35
well isuggest that the scarbourough council read the highway code section 91 i quote

"91
Driving when you are tired greatly increases your risk of collision. To minimise this risk

•make sure you are fit to drive. Do not begin a journey if you are tired. Get a good night’s sleep before embarking on a long journey
•avoid undertaking long journeys between midnight and 6 am, when natural alertness is at a minimum
•plan your journey to take sufficient breaks. A minimum break of at least 15 minutes after every two hours of driving is recommended
•if you feel at all sleepy, stop in a safe place. Do not stop on the hard shoulder of a motorway
•the most effective ways to counter sleepiness are to drink, for example, two cups of caffeinated coffee and to take a short nap (at least 15 minutes)"
so someone should point that out to them as they are a long way from me and by the time iget there iwould need a nap

Burtie
20-08-2012, 22:35
motorhomes are self sufficient i believe if that is how the owner wishes
to use it then so be it unless they want to enter a camp site to fill
with water and charge batterys. ive not been to scarborough for a
couple of years now but ive never had any trouble when i have been
but it now seems from what i read in these threads things are getting
a bit monotonous because of the stupidity of the residents spitting out
their dummys and a council that should know better. i am beginning to
wonder if its worth going up there when my mh is finally on the road or
do i have a change but i know one thing if i do end up in scarborough
and i have any trouble i may just blow my top in the council offices

iceman1956
20-08-2012, 23:04
The way I see things are "innocent until proven guilty" but as we all know because parking fines end up in the coffers of the councils, they tend to work the opposite "guilty" now you prove your innocent. Hoping like a lot do pay up inside 14 days or risk the higher fine.

I still believe if they slap on a ticket, and you appeal they would back down as they would still have to prove you had slept in the van, and as you have an address of the cottage your friends are staying in, they would loose because they could not show that you had not stayed at the cottage.

Firefox
21-08-2012, 01:16
Well you could be reading in the van or on the computer? How can they tell you are sleeping or otherwise. No friend's address is needed.

There's no offence in occupying a parked vehicle.

To be sensible, a law needs to be fair and enforcable. This is neither, hence it is stupid.

Burtie
21-08-2012, 01:36
It seams to me that some people don't like motorhome
owners doing their thing because they can't afford to do it.
should we complain about the residents of Scarborough
and Whitby if they visit our towns anytime they would know
how it feels

mandrake
21-08-2012, 05:02
the way i look at it is ,those no sleeping and no cooking notices have been there as long as i can remember in one form or another, and untill moving to wales have spent many years sleeping and cooking there and never had any problems .we like the place so used to go there often. ok they have wardens during the day, but i doubt they have them patroling all night long .so what are the chances of being caught ,i would say very slim .to be fined for sleeping ,they have to prove you was sleeping .now usualy when you sleep you dont have lights on ,so if they knock you dont answer the door cos your not in ,you were fishing or out clubbing dancing untill the wee hours. no law against that is there . as i look at it it is up to the councils to prove the offence in a court of law ,the same as a police officer .so dont worry enjoy yourself ,i think your biggest problem may come from the idiotic yobs that love to throw things at vans and not a ticket from the local council warden .not only that ,how much would you pay for aweekend in a hotel or flea ridden b and b and food for the day in scarborough or a weekend on a camp site and travel on a bus from the camp site to town and then meals and drnks in a cafe or pub .if you do get nicked its still a cheap weekend away .

jamesmarshall
21-08-2012, 07:12
The way I see it is that time and again we see proscription of motorhomes at local level. To some extent I can sympathise with Councillors who have a duty to respond to the needs and wishes of the people whom they were elected to serve but there is little if any logic applied or any attempt to find a solution acceptable to all.

Many on this forum make the point that we do spend money when we visit wherever but I doubt this carrys much weight with locals in the area. We don't do it out of altruism we do it out of necessity or for pleasure and we are not seen as bountiful saviours of the local shop or pub.

Perhaps the answer lies at national level, though this would need a concerted and persistant lobbying of our MPs from all areas of the motorhome 'fraternity'. A good argument for Aires would be the amount of income brought in from foreign motorhomers and the willingness of British campers to use them. We could start by taking full advantage of Aires already provided in order to ensure their success and then hold them up as examples to other local authorities.

Old_Arthur
21-08-2012, 07:33
Another thing to look at is when people are going for a day out they organise it and set off early to get parked up and enjoy their day out, but then people living local decide to take advantage of the good weather later in the day and drive round trying to get parked up when everyware is full thats when the motorhomes get noticed by their sheer size and take the brunt of the locals frustration i have seen the looks and noddin heads as they drive past,this never happens in the winter or bad weather when places are like ghost towns

jamesmarshall
21-08-2012, 07:41
Another thing to look at is when people are going for a day out they organise it and set off early to get parked up and enjoy their day out, but then people living local decide to take advantage of the good weather later in the day and drive round trying to get parked up when everyware is full thats when the motorhomes get noticed by their sheer size and take the brunt of the locals frustration i have seen the looks and noddin heads as they drive past,this never happens in the winter or bad weather when places are like ghost towns

Sad thing is you are right. A year ago Jackie and I spent a week in B&B in Whiby (great accommodation and marvellous breakfast) and for the most part our car took up a free parking spot on the street as we hardly used it. Just one of many cars from out of town clogging up Whitby's arterial network and not a word said.

elainekirk
21-08-2012, 08:12
All laws have to be human rights compliant so I would ask them to forward you paperwork that shows that their rules do not infringe on your rights. I can see many arguments that question whether it is compliant not least the ' proportionate' angle, is their banning of sleeping in a legally parked motorhome proportionate to the perceived problem of motorhome parking? I would be interested to see the council emailer respond to that question.

Daiboy
21-08-2012, 08:41
Why don't we send Oldish Hippy down there, his Rascarry is tiny so won't cause offence. OH doesn't sleep anyway. Test out there system so to speak. I'd chip in a nights car parking to give him a holiday. LOL:sleep-027:

seriously though perhaps we could collectively (but individually) email the council and ask them for their reasons and ask them to reserve an area for us or ask them for a suitable alternative.

Daiboy

jamesmarshall
21-08-2012, 08:51
Motorhomers could always get radical.
A one day sit in at a major car park in Whitby or Scarborough. A convoy of motorhomers arrive at 6am at a designated car park at peak season, purchase tickets all day, take over the whole car park , ensure press publicity and have banners to the effect "We are motorhomers not pariahs" the trick would be to park legally for the day and leave before the overnight rules apply. Maximum disruption, legally gained, National publicity, point made.

John H
21-08-2012, 08:59
No one has to prove they were or were not in the vehicle. The onus is on the council to prove not only someone was sleeping in the vehicle, but who that person was. Just the same as a policeman has to prove who was driving a specific vehicle at a specific time. You would be under no obligation to state who was in that vehicle.
Also does the same rule apply to people eating and sleeping in cars, vans, lorries etc? If not then the are discriminating against you. How many people do you see eating in their cars on a sea front, or having a sleep after dinner etc?

Precisely - and we once escaped a fine for speeding by saying that we couldn't remember which of us was driving at the time (the photos only showed the back of the motorhome). Ultimately, the onus is on the council to prove that you were in the van and "camping" (which is not defined in law anyway!). As Firefox says, a law has to be fair and enforceable; this is neither. Elainekirk raises another interesting point relating to human rights. All in all, they haven't thought it through!

Daiboy
21-08-2012, 09:03
Motorhomers could always get radical.
A one day sit in at a major car park in Whitby or Scarborough. A convoy of motorhomers arrive at 6am at a designated car park at peak season, purchase tickets all day, take over the whole car park , ensure press publicity and have banners to the effect "We are motorhomers not pariahs" the trick would be to park legally for the day and leave before the overnight rules apply. Maximum disruption, legally gained, National publicity, point made.

I agree we could even stay awake all night ( perhaps in shifts) I wonder what they would/could do if 1 person was awake all night but other family members were asleep. On the other hand what if you had an hours nap in the afternoon?

Burtie
21-08-2012, 09:08
I for one will own up to sleeping in my mh
as that's what it was made for if not they
would of made them without beds or cookers
so let the Scarborough residents bring it on

elainekirk
21-08-2012, 09:15
Taking over a car park sounds logical to us but once you bring public perception into play it takes on a different dimension , the anti lobby would use it as an example of how they perceive us to be taking over.
I know it is the long haul route but tying the regulators up with their own red tape is the most secure route... after all they legally defined human rights which logically are already ours so how they managed to take over them and then gift them back to us is another question.... let's just use our rights to trump their hand ..

robjk
21-08-2012, 09:42
Taking over a car park would get publicity but I think the council would then take the easy way out for them and just install height barriers.

John Thompson
21-08-2012, 12:16
A lot of fighting talk on here, but Scarborough has only decided to ban motorhome parking (including sleeping and eating) on defined streets and car parks, after making provision on some of their other car parks for "overnight camping!" at £10 per night.

The price may be wrong, as they are not providing any facilities other than parking, but they have made provision so discrimination could be countered.

The way I read it, was that they were banning Motor Caravan Parking even if it was not occupied between certain hours on those prescribed streets and car parks. If I remember correctly is was to apply very early, something like 7pm to 7am.

This is no different to the bans on delivery vehicles between certain hours using a street.

John

Casperthe Ghost
22-08-2012, 21:22
Re overnight parking some guy probably a motorhomer took the local authorities in the north of Scotland to court on that point and won the case and all the notices have to come down by the end of August whether they will or not we will have to wait and see however if not and they try to prosecute they wont have any success so will the same law apply in England and Wales
Casper

iceman1956
26-08-2012, 17:51
A lot of fighting talk on here, but Scarborough has only decided to ban motorhome parking (including sleeping and eating) on defined streets and car parks, after making provision on some of their other car parks for "overnight camping!" at £10 per night.

The price may be wrong, as they are not providing any facilities other than parking, but they have made provision so discrimination could be countered.

The way I read it, was that they were banning Motor Caravan Parking even if it was not occupied between certain hours on those prescribed streets and car parks. If I remember correctly is was to apply very early, something like 7pm to 7am.

This is no different to the bans on delivery vehicles between certain hours using a street.

John


Attached is a reply I have received from Jane Wilson. [Jane.Wilson@scarborough.gov.]. when I requested clarification on the overnight charge as the parking charge clearly states 24 hours. As can be seen they have progressed the ban on street parking but withdrawn the overnight sleeping proposal.
Scarborough Borough Council are responsible for Off Street parking in the Borough of Scarborough, for clarification overnight camping has historically not been permitted on any of these car parks. The link provided by Jayne I cannot get it to work.

The article in the Whitby Gazette referred to considerations given by the Parking Review group in relation to motor caravan parking. *The link below provides details of the report to the individual cabinet member responsible for parking

http://delphi/ieListDocuments.aspx?CId=462&MId=4166&Ver=4

The recommendation to dedicate 3 car parks to allow overnight camping was referred back to the review group for consideration. *The decision was made not to pursue this option as allowing the overnight stay of Camper Vans was considered to represent a material change of use from car park to a mix of car park and camping/caravan use. As such it was considered that planning permission would need to be sought. * Planning officer provided the following comments

It is considered that there is little basis for allowing the use of car parks for overnight camper van stays under current or future policy. There are many other options available for overnight stays with availability on existing large sites as well as the significant number of certificated sites within the Borough. *The rationale behind this policy was the view that there were sufficient sites and pitches available in the Borough at that time, and that further provision could begin to erode the character of the area.

For clarification should you purchase a coach ticket for £15 this ticket covers you for parking for 24 hours as with any other 24 hour ticket purchased, however this does not allow you to use the vehicle for camping.

yorkslass
26-08-2012, 18:35
It is very interesting.

So motorhomes being parked there is not a problem; this is nothing at all to do with parking.
The issue is sleeping or eating in a way that does not produce revenue for the town.

I think it is time we asked why we can not sleep or eat on our vehicles. I am a citizen, I pay my taxes, my vehicle is legal.

Hmmmm

we were in whitby during the regatta and i saw lots of people eating food they had brought with them in their cars and as we walked down the road two nappies had been dumped in the gutter despite a nearby bin.:mad2: it seems all this is ok so long as your not in a motorhome.

maureenandtom
26-08-2012, 19:23
Attached is a reply I have received from Jane Wilson. [Jane.Wilson@scarborough.gov.]. when I requested clarification on the overnight charge as the parking charge clearly states 24 hours. As can be seen they have progressed the ban on street parking but withdrawn the overnight sleeping proposal.
Scarborough Borough Council are responsible for Off Street parking in the Borough of Scarborough, for clarification overnight camping has historically not been permitted on any of these car parks. The link provided by Jayne I cannot get it to work.

The article in the Whitby Gazette referred to considerations given by the Parking Review group in relation to motor caravan parking. *The link below provides details of the report to the individual cabinet member responsible for parking

http://delphi/ieListDocuments.aspx?CId=462&MId=4166&Ver=4

The recommendation to dedicate 3 car parks to allow overnight camping was referred back to the review group for consideration. *The decision was made not to pursue this option as allowing the overnight stay of Camper Vans was considered to represent a material change of use from car park to a mix of car park and camping/caravan use. As such it was considered that planning permission would need to be sought. * Planning officer provided the following comments

It is considered that there is little basis for allowing the use of car parks for overnight camper van stays under current or future policy. There are many other options available for overnight stays with availability on existing large sites as well as the significant number of certificated sites within the Borough. *The rationale behind this policy was the view that there were sufficient sites and pitches available in the Borough at that time, and that further provision could begin to erode the character of the area.

For clarification should you purchase a coach ticket for £15 this ticket covers you for parking for 24 hours as with any other 24 hour ticket purchased, however this does not allow you to use the vehicle for camping.

This is probably the link you were to have been given:

http://democracy.scarborough.gov.uk/documents/s43629/12332%20-%20Motorhomes%20-%2020120627.pdf

Save a copy if you find it interesting. Other documentation, previously available, seems to be no longer available (links not working).

Got to laugh, haven't you?

Elected representatives consider a problem and come up with an answer - provide Aires (Paragraph 3.11). A (presumably) unelected planner comes up with the same nonsense that unelected parking officers came up with originally and it all seems to have all fallen down. Who runs this council? Our Representatives? Or our Employees?

fairytooth
26-08-2012, 19:32
[QUOTE=kimbowbill;228350 if you don't hear from me after my weekend, take it the Scarbadions have killed me :scared:[/QUOTE]


I think they will be known as 'Scabbies' to me from now on. :banana:

Burtie
26-08-2012, 20:27
But as somebody said in these threads my question is
that I've heard of all the trouble about mh parking at
Whitby but let's face it there is not a lot of choice of
where to park in Whitby unless on the main carparks in
the town centre then on them you could get blocked in by
cars but I've never had a problem at Scarborough so is
it just certain places in Scarborough

elainekirk
26-08-2012, 22:04
for clarification overnight camping has historically not been permitted on any of these car parks.
.
.
They are funny, historically funny,
.
Roughly translated they are saying that they have had legal advice and they are dropping this hot potato before they get burnt ..
.
That reply made me laugh so much the tears ran down my leg

oldish hippy
26-08-2012, 22:16
well needs some brave soul to fit a extremley loud siren to a made up camper and stay a night in bed and breakfast so when he bangs on windows to see if you sre sleeping it goes off and wakes up half the town and he then wombles out after few mins to turn it off bet they wouldnt like that but dont forget to park it somewhere legal lol

Doodles
27-08-2012, 07:12
Why not make a sign up saying this vehicle is unoccupied but alarmed and put it in the window.Then take a photo to show clearly the time this was displayed as Mr parking attendant would if he gave you a ticket and then you should be safe to leave it for the night :)

donkey too
27-08-2012, 07:53
This is probably the link you were to have been given:

http://democracy.scarborough.gov.uk/documents/s43629/12332%20-%20Motorhomes%20-%2020120627.pdf

Save a copy if you find it interesting. Other documentation, previously available, seems to be no longer available (links not working).

Got to laugh, haven't you?

Elected representatives consider a problem and come up with an answer - provide Aires (Paragraph 3.11). A (presumably) unelected planner comes up with the same nonsense that unelected parking officers came up with originally and it all seems to have all fallen down. Who runs this council? Our Representatives? Or our Employees?


From experience of being a councillor on a total of5 different councils over the years I can assure you that it is the employees who run the council. :rulez:. This is also the same in Central Government.
There were a lot of truths in that old programme Yes Miister.

Greytop
31-08-2012, 12:15
I live in Scarborough and it seems to me life goes on as normal for Motorhome'rs. If there is a ban in place you certainly would not guess!!
Every weekend (and often during week) there are anything between 2 and 25 (maximum I have counted) parked around the marine drive winter and summer. Most of these stay overnight and often a few nights.
It is £6 to park there and as long as they have paid there parking dues nobody bothers them. Parking is free in winter and still nobody bothers them.
All in all it is a great place to park overlooking the sea.
I really don't think they will be getting a visit from some jobsworth, council worker at any time in the near future.
I have also never heard a word said by residents about the Motorhomes parked there as to the average person it is something that is always there. Now local traders I can imagine complaining although have no eveidence of it.
Certainly the local police won't bother you as they very rarely come out after dark, and only then if some sort of mass murder has occured, which cannot be put of until morning!!

Burtie
31-08-2012, 15:14
I live in Scarborough and it seems to me life goes on as normal for Motorhome'rs. If there is a ban in place you certainly would not guess!!
Every weekend (and often during week) there are anything between 2 and 25 (maximum I have counted) parked around the marine drive winter and summer. Most of these stay overnight and often a few nights.
It is £6 to park there and as long as they have paid there parking dues nobody bothers them. Parking is free in winter and still nobody bothers them.
All in all it is a great place to park overlooking the sea.
I really don't think they will be getting a visit from some jobsworth, council worker at any time in the near future.
I have also never heard a word said by residents about the Motorhomes parked there as to the average person it is something that is always there. Now local traders I can imagine complaining although have no eveidence of it.
Certainly the local police won't bother you as they very rarely come out after dark, and only then if some sort of mass murder has occured, which cannot be put of until morning!!

as said in one of my threads I've never had any problems around that part apart from cars blasting horns
so is it only certain parts of Scarborough all I can guess is are some parking in odd places as I like to park out of the way of main towns or residents homes

kimbowbill
01-09-2012, 06:37
I live in Scarborough and it seems to me life goes on as normal for Motorhome'rs. If there is a ban in place you certainly would not guess!!
Every weekend (and often during week) there are anything between 2 and 25 (maximum I have counted) parked around the marine drive winter and summer. Most of these stay overnight and often a few nights.
It is £6 to park there and as long as they have paid there parking dues nobody bothers them. Parking is free in winter and still nobody bothers them.
All in all it is a great place to park overlooking the sea.
I really don't think they will be getting a visit from some jobsworth, council worker at any time in the near future.
I have also never heard a word said by residents about the Motorhomes parked there as to the average person it is something that is always there. Now local traders I can imagine complaining although have no eveidence of it.
Certainly the local police won't bother you as they very rarely come out after dark, and only then if some sort of mass murder has occured, which cannot be put of until morning!!

Thanks for this Greytop, but if you read the thread, Scarborough traders complain and also follow the articles in your local paper, and read the new parking proposals, you will see there is a big problem, it might not have been implemented as yet but it sure is gunna be, then all the MH's you see on marine drive, will be driving round looking for somewhere to stay for the night, outside residents houses probably, then back down to the the front for the day,

jamesmarshall
01-09-2012, 07:29
I watched a news item From Scarborough on BBC Breakfast television a couple of mornings ago. The gist of the story was how the poor weather had slashed visitor numbers to the resort over the summer. A number of traders were speaking to camera about how their incomes had been severely affected. One talked of how families were arriving in cars and eating their own pre-packed food rather than spend in the town. I couldn't help but smile at the irony of his statement.

yorkslass
01-09-2012, 08:43
All laws have to be human rights compliant so I would ask them to forward you paperwork that shows that their rules do not infringe on your rights. I can see many arguments that question whether it is compliant not least the ' proportionate' angle, is their banning of sleeping in a legally parked motorhome proportionate to the perceived problem of motorhome parking? I would be interested to see the council emailer respond to that question.

i was in whitby a couple of weeks ago and i posted in full a temporary sign that had been attached to a couple of lamposts stating that motorhomes would no longer be able to park on north terrace whitby{between 11pm and7am} for environmental reasons to prevent occupants of motorcaravans depositing waste on the highway. i was furious when i read it as it didnt seem to be a proportionate response to the perceived problem. to take their reasoning to its logical conclusion they should also ban all vehicles and visitors cos ive seen lots of mess left at the side of the road, particularly marine drive in scarboro dropped by boy racers. last time i was there i cleared all the litter near us myself. i agree with you the human rights angle is something to bear in mind.:dog:

yorkslass
01-09-2012, 08:47
I emailed SBC for some clarity on parking, this is my email

Hi

I understand there is no parking of Motorhomes in Scarborough and surrounding areas

I am staying in a cottage at Robin Hoods bay with my family, 7th - 8th Sept 2012 my only mode of transport is my Motorhome, where my dogs will be staying. My intention was to park the van in the top car park and stay with my family in the cottage, but now i see this is banned, can you advise me where i can park, i will not be sleeping in my van,

Kind regards


this is their response

Dear Ms

A vehicle may park overnight providing a ticket is purchased to cover any time between 9am and 6pm. However the Civil Enforcement Officer will issue a ticket should he believe that the vehicle is being used for camping or cooking.

Regards

Parking Services

Is it me or is that just the most stupidest response ever? what does it mean? so basically how i read it is they can issue a ticket and you have to prove your not in the van or do they have to prove you are in the van ?

enjoy your weekend and dont let it bother you.:dance:

canalwheeler
01-09-2012, 10:06
I know we all have different preferences when it comes to destinations, but I don't have these parking problems. I don't like seaside resorts, particularly Scarborough. I don't mind Whitby for a day but I wouldn't want to overnight anywhere near the place. Best to go by steam from Pickering.

I'm certainly not interested in camping where I'm not wanted. Give me the wild wild camping coastal spots where no-one bothers you or is trying to sell you stuff at inflated prices.

There is nothing like having a whole beach to yourself.

Uncle Tone (brushing sand out of beard...... and dog)

7767

Greytop
01-09-2012, 17:41
Just been for a walk today and there were probably 20 Motorhomes parked on the drive. Not doing any harm to anyone and having paid their £6.00 parking fee no doubt.
I really cannot see a problem as there were plenty of parking places available for anyone else who wanted to park here.
Councils should encourage Motorhomes not discourage them!!!
77757776777777787779

bikercat
17-09-2012, 16:44
Hi

Hubby was at Scarborough over the week-end at the Gold Cup and he went for a ride past at nights.

Friday night 7 MH parked up for night at North End one having BBQ and some with wedges under wheels.

Saturday night 11 MH parked up for night at North End

Nic


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